Comments on: The Explosive Secret Story in Iran http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/ Post Conceptual Art at the Intersection of Cutting Edge Science and Ancient Wisdom Sun, 22 Apr 2012 01:58:56 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Jonathon Guzy http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-1431 Jonathon Guzy Tue, 03 Aug 2010 04:01:51 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-1431 There's a Civil Warn anecdote that goes roughly like this- a squad of Union soldiers capture a lone, ragged Confederate private. It was obvious that he owned no slaves, wasn't interested in questions of state sovereignty, or trade tariffs, had no stake preserving the "southern way of life". When they asked him why he was fighting he had a simple answer- "because y'all are down here". The point is that our presence there is reason enough for many Afghans to fight us. Whether or not we are in the "right" doesn't matter much, unfortunately. There’s a Civil Warn anecdote that goes roughly like this- a squad of Union soldiers capture a lone, ragged Confederate private. It was obvious that he owned no slaves, wasn’t interested in questions of state sovereignty, or trade tariffs, had no stake preserving the “southern way of life”. When they asked him why he was fighting he had a simple answer- “because y’all are down here”. The point is that our presence there is reason enough for many Afghans to fight us. Whether or not we are in the “right” doesn’t matter much, unfortunately.

]]> By: Iran’s Ayatollah Khamenei critically wounded or dead? | Art of Seeing the Divine Blog http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-1150 Iran’s Ayatollah Khamenei critically wounded or dead? | Art of Seeing the Divine Blog Sun, 04 Apr 2010 01:57:23 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-1150 [...] That story became: The Explosive Secret Story in Iran. http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/ [...] [...] That story became: The Explosive Secret Story in Iran. http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/ [...]

]]> By: Dinescuss http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-757 Dinescuss Thu, 09 Jul 2009 15:10:54 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-757 Khamenei, Yazdi & Ahmadinejad are stange enough to be suspected of using Talibans ... but I doubt that such info would be made available to you. Most likely this is an intoxication. I am rather suspicions on why nobody suspects Mousavi, founder of Hezbollah, of being the system's trojan horse. Who's mission clould be to crash the pragmatical trend who grew in Iran recently. Mousavi said he is prepared to dye for freedom, but he doesn't take the risk of being even arrested. What a hero of him! Khamenei, Yazdi & Ahmadinejad are stange enough to be suspected of using Talibans … but I doubt that such info would be made available to you. Most likely this is an intoxication.

I am rather suspicions on why nobody suspects Mousavi, founder of Hezbollah, of being the system’s trojan horse. Who’s mission clould be to crash the pragmatical trend who grew in Iran recently.

Mousavi said he is prepared to dye for freedom, but he doesn’t take the risk of being even arrested. What a hero of him!

]]> By: duckdaotsu http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-756 duckdaotsu Thu, 09 Jul 2009 08:10:27 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-756 Throughout the Mahem and in attempts to clarify the power of reaction and then retraction by so many who discovered power in the hands on keyboard/texts; I have attempted to ask those people who would not utilize integrity to slow down. Retrace steps. Backtrack sources. Understand the RESPONSIBILITY of journalistic ethics, training, rules and emotional non-bias. Instead of heedingg warnings that tweeters were traumatized by "snuff" films, outside factions with political agendas and finally - a desperate call to STOP and look at the big picture, I was threatened both with hate and by personal contact to my long-term professional media company and even was approached with intent of physical violence to my home and family. When media is in hands of albeit well-intentioned but untrained and therefore strongly biased public POV, we have what I deem a total failure on the part of a crowd-frenzied mentality.  The only greater good I now see from this lesson of frenzied reaction is a new understanding of journalism and media ethics. May the people put down their weapons -- in this case, our  Twitter "reporting" -- and learn the most difficult lesson of all: Power corrupts, weapons are often words, and bombs dropped from ineffectual random reporting kills as many or more than those that exploded in the streets.  May we find personal peace, stop pointing fingers at other government states, and own up to the over 100,000 innocent lives taken by the words and weapons of our OWN political rhetoric in a nearby country called Iraq. Let Project Iranian Freedom drop the shock and awe in our own gut and find it's way to our TRUE responibility: War on Iraq and Afghanistan. In loving service and perpetual diligence, Lisbeth West duckdaotsu media arts IRE, IPPN, mediachannel.org affiliate A 15 year project toward education through pacifist principles Throughout the Mahem and in attempts to clarify the power of reaction and then retraction by so many who discovered power in the hands on keyboard/texts; I have attempted to ask those people who would not utilize integrity to slow down. Retrace steps. Backtrack sources. Understand the RESPONSIBILITY of journalistic ethics, training, rules and emotional non-bias. Instead of heedingg warnings that tweeters were traumatized by “snuff” films, outside factions with political agendas and finally – a desperate call to STOP and look at the big picture, I was threatened both with hate and by personal contact to my long-term professional media company and even was approached with intent of physical violence to my home and family. When media is in hands of albeit well-intentioned but untrained and therefore strongly biased public POV, we have what I deem a total failure on the part of a crowd-frenzied mentality. 

The only greater good I now see from this lesson of frenzied reaction is a new understanding of journalism and media ethics. May the people put down their weapons — in this case, our
 Twitter “reporting” — and learn the most difficult lesson of all: Power corrupts, weapons are often words, and bombs dropped from ineffectual random reporting kills as many or more than those that exploded in the streets. 

May we find personal peace, stop pointing fingers at other government states, and own up to the over 100,000 innocent lives taken by the words and weapons of our OWN political rhetoric in a nearby country called Iraq.

Let Project Iranian Freedom drop the shock and awe in our own gut and find it’s way to our TRUE responibility: War on Iraq and Afghanistan.

In loving service and perpetual diligence,

Lisbeth West
duckdaotsu media arts
IRE, IPPN, mediachannel.org affiliate
A 15 year project toward education through pacifist principles

]]> By: daleandersen http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-755 daleandersen Thu, 09 Jul 2009 06:38:34 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-755 I think your report is partly bullshit. I can see Shia Hizbollah volunteers helping their Iranian paymasters, yes. Hamas, possibly, but it's a bit of a stretch. Sunni and Shia do not mix well. If Hamas did in fact send volunteers, it would have to explain why it did so to some very angry Saudis, Jordanians and Egyptians. This leads me to the Taliban. The Taliban are the Mullahs' nightmare. If the Taliban ever gets its hands on those Paki nukes, trust me on this, the first place it would use them is on Iran. Shia are polytheists. As bad as Christians. Worse even, because they lead otherwise good Muslims astray. Believe me, when the Taliban restores the Caliphate, there will be no Shia. Only Sunni. I think your report is partly bullshit.

I can see Shia Hizbollah volunteers helping their Iranian paymasters, yes.

Hamas, possibly, but it’s a bit of a stretch. Sunni and Shia do not mix well. If Hamas did in fact send volunteers, it would have to explain why it did so to some very angry Saudis, Jordanians and Egyptians.

This leads me to the Taliban. The Taliban are the Mullahs’ nightmare. If the Taliban ever gets its hands on those Paki nukes, trust me on this, the first place it would use them is on Iran. Shia are polytheists. As bad as Christians. Worse even, because they lead otherwise good Muslims astray.

Believe me, when the Taliban restores the Caliphate, there will be no Shia. Only Sunni.

]]> By: judyrey http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-754 judyrey Thu, 09 Jul 2009 06:08:12 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-754 First, thanks to everyone for their comments. A week ago I would have agreed with you about the Taliban. The reason the story remained a secret and is explosive is that until recently the comments made about how the Taliban would not be welcomed in Ira seemed true. However on You Tube you can find a video of Ahmedinejad speaking in Farsi with subtitles in both French and English, Khamenei is on his side and he is addressing a seated group of clerics who seem important to the government. The link to this video, the second part of the speech is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVPLU_6B15k&feature=related About 4:44 minutes into the video Ahmedinejad says, “I thank the Talibans present here, those beloved friends who act only for Allah and lead this movement of immense truth. I know how much they invested themselves and put their very lives on the line here in Qom or elsewhere, I know that they borrowed money and dedicated their whole life to Allah’s service.” Note that IDT puts the Taliban in Qom. My info comes after the YT video was made. You can see the video and that proof for yourself. On one thing you are unfortunately correct. And it is in my article that the Taliban in Qom are terrorizing the people with their violence. The article indicates that they are becoming more and more out of the Iranian government's control, too. Next, Although Mousavi did not call for the protest, I could not find a reputable source that did. Mousavi has just called for the one today, by the way. Also the people who were tweeting about that protest were not the Iranian sources we rely on. It was being Tweeted and RTed by others, many of whom were new. Since I am the source about the protest and what occurred in my DMs I can say that there was more activity that led me to become suspicious past the DMs that pushed me to promote the protest. First, thanks to everyone for their comments.

A week ago I would have agreed with you about the Taliban.

The reason the story remained a secret and is explosive is that until recently the comments made about how the Taliban would not be welcomed in Ira seemed true. However on You Tube you can find a video of Ahmedinejad speaking in Farsi with subtitles in both French and English, Khamenei is on his side and he is addressing a seated group of clerics who seem important to the government. The link to this video, the second part of the speech is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVPLU_6B15k&feature=related

About 4:44 minutes into the video Ahmedinejad says, “I thank the Talibans present here, those beloved friends who act only for Allah and lead this movement of immense truth. I know how much they invested themselves and put their very lives on the line here in Qom or elsewhere, I know that they borrowed money and dedicated their whole life to Allah’s service.”
Note that IDT puts the Taliban in Qom. My info comes after the YT video was made. You can see the video and that proof for yourself.

On one thing you are unfortunately correct. And it is in my article that the Taliban in Qom are terrorizing the people with their violence. The article indicates that they are becoming more and more out of the Iranian government’s control, too.

Next, Although Mousavi did not call for the protest, I could not find a reputable source that did. Mousavi has just called for the one today, by the way. Also the people who were tweeting about that protest were not the Iranian sources we rely on. It was being Tweeted and RTed by others, many of whom were new.

Since I am the source about the protest and what occurred in my DMs I can say that there was more activity that led me to become suspicious past the DMs that pushed me to promote the protest.

]]> By: George http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-753 George Thu, 09 Jul 2009 05:57:06 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-753 A note on the video you referred to for the presence of Taliban: first, he uses the word "tollab" which means "clerics", it is just a case of bad translation. Second, the guy beside him is not Khamenei. It is Ayatollah Mesbah Yazdi which many believe is the intellectual force behind Ahmadinejad and Khamenei because he promotes a school of thought in Islam that says the people shouldn't really have a vote in how they are governed, and that the important thing is who God votes for (he believes "the supreme leader"). People believe that it is this school of thought which makes them think its OK to rig elections. Yazdi supporters quote a hadith saying "People are like 4-legged animals, they need to be shepherded". Third, this video is nevertheless very interesting because it shows Ahmadinejad talking about plans to carry out some great feat that would get Iran closer to "pure Islam". That is why many think in this session he is talking about how he's going to lead a coup to install Yazdi's vision of Islam. A note on the video you referred to for the presence of Taliban: first, he uses the word “tollab” which means “clerics”, it is just a case of bad translation.

Second, the guy beside him is not Khamenei. It is Ayatollah Mesbah Yazdi which many believe is the intellectual force behind Ahmadinejad and Khamenei because he promotes a school of thought in Islam that says the people shouldn’t really have a vote in how they are governed, and that the important thing is who God votes for (he believes “the supreme leader”). People believe that it is this school of thought which makes them think its OK to rig elections. Yazdi supporters quote a hadith saying “People are like 4-legged animals, they need to be shepherded”.

Third, this video is nevertheless very interesting because it shows Ahmadinejad talking about plans to carry out some great feat that would get Iran closer to “pure Islam”. That is why many think in this session he is talking about how he’s going to lead a coup to install Yazdi’s vision of Islam.

]]> By: George http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-752 George Thu, 09 Jul 2009 05:49:29 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-752 Hi Judy, I am a member in a twitter team that has become known as a reliable source on Iran with more than 10,000 followers. I appreciate your help on #IranElection but I must say that you're distance from what's actually going on is considerable. Although I can't completely dismiss your claim that the coup forces are running out of control, I do have many reservations about your conclusions. For example, the Hezbollah is very likely to work with the Iranian government, but Hamas is much less likely, and Taliban is not likely at all! Hamas and Taliban are not Shiite Muslims. The Iranians helped the US considerably in beating the Taliban in Afghanistan by providing intelligence. As for the "trap" demonstrations. U r right, Mousavi didn't call for it. But he doesn't call for many of the demonstrations. He is not actually that free to do these things. People are using social networks to put out recommendations of what to do next and voting on each other's recommendations. This is done mostly through balatarin.com which has a mechanism like digg.com only in Persian. Gaining membership in balatarin.com is much harder than digg. Also ppl put out recommendations on mailing lists & facebook and discuss them and good recommendations get forwarded more often. The rally routes are never a secret and nobody worries about them leaking. Because the militia will find out any way. Mousavi himself actually likes this approach! He has said in a meeting with 70 professors (the audio was uploaded a few days later) that he believes in this "plurality of leadership". He's actually enjoying the amount of creativity and harmony that ppl are achieving using balatarin.com, facebook, email, twitter, etc. He does set some general guidelines that people follow but he's not really able to speak as freely as he wants because he doesn't want to create an excuse for his arrest. People such as Mohsen Sazgara have been very effective in translating Mousavi's guidelines and the creative recommendations in social networking sites into operational actions. Sazgara uses this YouTube channel to provide operational strategies for people on the ground: http://www.youtube.com/user/adminsazegara he is very popular among balatarin.com users and the pro-democracy moevement in general. Hi Judy,
I am a member in a twitter team that has become known as a reliable source on Iran with more than 10,000 followers. I appreciate your help on #IranElection but I must say that you’re distance from what’s actually going on is considerable. Although I can’t completely dismiss your claim that the coup forces are running out of control, I do have many reservations about your conclusions. For example, the Hezbollah is very likely to work with the Iranian government, but Hamas is much less likely, and Taliban is not likely at all! Hamas and Taliban are not Shiite Muslims. The Iranians helped the US considerably in beating the Taliban in Afghanistan by providing intelligence.

As for the “trap” demonstrations. U r right, Mousavi didn’t call for it. But he doesn’t call for many of the demonstrations. He is not actually that free to do these things. People are using social networks to put out recommendations of what to do next and voting on each other’s recommendations. This is done mostly through balatarin.com which has a mechanism like digg.com only in Persian. Gaining membership in balatarin.com is much harder than digg. Also ppl put out recommendations on mailing lists & facebook and discuss them and good recommendations get forwarded more often. The rally routes are never a secret and nobody worries about them leaking. Because the militia will find out any way.

Mousavi himself actually likes this approach! He has said in a meeting with 70 professors (the audio was uploaded a few days later) that he believes in this “plurality of leadership”. He’s actually enjoying the amount of creativity and harmony that ppl are achieving using balatarin.com, facebook, email, twitter, etc. He does set some general guidelines that people follow but he’s not really able to speak as freely as he wants because he doesn’t want to create an excuse for his arrest.

People such as Mohsen Sazgara have been very effective in translating Mousavi’s guidelines and the creative recommendations in social networking sites into operational actions. Sazgara uses this YouTube channel to provide operational strategies for people on the ground:
http://www.youtube.com/user/adminsazegara
he is very popular among balatarin.com users and the pro-democracy moevement in general.

]]> By: Katayoun http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-750 Katayoun Thu, 09 Jul 2009 03:24:48 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-750 i missed the s at the end of green. i missed the s at the end of green.

]]> By: Katayoun http://ungravenimage.com/blog/2009/07/the-explosive-secret-story-in-iran/comment-page-1/#comment-749 Katayoun Thu, 09 Jul 2009 03:22:09 +0000 http://ungravenimage.com/blog/?p=439#comment-749 Hi, Thanks for this great article. I am sad after reading it. The translation of the statement beneath this is enclosed. If you can please change it. My silence is more powerful than your club: ???? ?? ??????? ?? ?? ???? ???? Just some pointers: Farsi is written from right to left and it is not legible when it is all "capitalized". I love translating from Farsi to English, so if you need something to be translated please contact me. Katayoun is not my real name but I live in Los Angeles. Hi,
Thanks for this great article. I am sad after reading it. The translation of the statement beneath this is enclosed. If you can please change it.

My silence is more powerful than your club:
???? ?? ??????? ?? ?? ???? ????
Just some pointers: Farsi is written from right to left and it is not legible when it is all “capitalized”.

I love translating from Farsi to English, so if you need something to be translated please contact me. Katayoun is not my real name but I live in Los Angeles.

]]>